LV-N exceeds 75% of its full power at just 7700m altitude on Kerbin. Plane bouncing on takeoff - Gameplay Questions and Tutorials - Kerbal Space Program Forums Hello, I am having a small problem with a plane I have built. As you approach 35-50 km, your aircraft will most likely level itself out, at which point you can try aiming about five degrees above the horizon line. Though, I use the FAR mod which will change things, so I can't guarantee the results will be useful, but it might be interesting. The tutorial below explains everything very well. A good example of this is at the KSC runway when landing on a 90 degree bearing. Because of how small Kerbin is and how high its gravity is, a perfectly flat surface just north of the equator will cause planes taking off to bias to the right of the runway, as if they were rolling downhill. If you are using B9 Rocketery or other parts that utilize Firesplitter, this is normal. You can resolve the emergency by transferring fuel from rear fuel tanks to forward fuel tanks, but you should alter your design to bring your wings further back to prevent such incidents in the future. Balanced fuel saves Kerbal lives. Plane wobble during takeoff - KSP1 Gameplay Questions and Tutorials - Kerbal Space Program Forums Is there a way to place landing gear so that i can guarantee my plane can remain stable on the runway even at high speed in excess of 200m/s? wings, unless they're very well braced). I have also thought about a wider base. I managed to successfully takeoff and land this aircraft at least 20 times in a roll now and I haven't even lost a single pilot flying this. https://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/124380-wing-lift-amp-wing-lift-to-drag-ratio-charts/, https://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?title=Tutorial:_Spaceplane_basics&oldid=100619. Here are a few pictures of it: Take a picture with center of mass and center of lift turned on. You need to make sure that the Orange axis on the rotate sphere is parallel to your, nose-tail axis. Upload or insert images from URL. If you plan on either dropping off cargo or picking up cargo and traveling with it, you'll generally want to locate your cargo bay at the middle of your center of gravity. (However, it must be noted that it is bad practice to use ailerons as elevators since it makes it hard to control the aircraft), The rudder moves the tip of the plane left and right; it is rarely used, since it is hard to put it both up and down due to the possibility of hitting the ground. and our As such, you may want to line all forward Mk1 radial nodes on your aircraft with shock cones, if possible. Also note that for maximum efficiency, you should make sure that your horizontal control surfaces are rotated to exactly the same pitch that you've rotated your wings. Also note that shock cone intakes appear to provide the best air supply at all mach speeds, and unlike other air intakes, they do not decline in performance beyond certain mach speeds. While I am not a great plane builder there is a part in the structural (I think it is a pylon?) Pasted as rich text. Necessary for heavy/long spaceplane. "Type E" is the smallest you should have, and you want a set of those connected at the back of the fuselage. See the tutorial below. All you need to do is add landing gear (one right before the cockpit, and two on the tips or middle of the wings), and you're done! Note that the lift rating does not mean that the wings will automatically lift a spaceplane into the air when it's moving forward. If rear landing gear are strutted together, or braced to a center point, they are less likely to torque in different directions. Similar principles apply when finding suitable landing sites away from the KSC. Doesnt make sense so just do this: Nope that didn't solve anything, even when the plane is past the runway and gliding on the little bit of space before the ocean it will slowly lower to the ocean, what am I doing wrong? (Sorry For Poor Image Quality) : r/KerbalAcademy 385 votes, 49 comments. Clear editor. Your very own tutorial.). KSC's runway is slightly north of Kerbin's equator and perfectly flat. Thermal turbulence, caused by convection, happens below clouds and typically only impacts planes during takeoff and landing. Note: This tutorial was last updated for version 1.7.2. You can deploy your chutes just prior to touchdown for rapid deceleration. Canards and horizontal tail fins should be placed as far towards the front and back of your aircraft as possible, respectively. This ensures that your aircraft will go up once it achieves a high enough speed, and also helps with placing ailerons. An altitude set to 18,000 meters tops off at 19,000 meters and drops to 15,700 meters . Heavy Cargo Space Plane SSTO Download. Works well on small craft. I have never successfully landed a single aircraft before as they all tend to roll over when landing at high speed. Does anybidy have any tips on how to build spaceplanes? 3. make sure your center of mass is slightly in front of center of lift force. A Mk1 Cockpit, two Mk 1 Liquid Fuel Tanks, and then cap the back with a round nose cone (use the A/D keys to rotate it as necessary). For your first flight, it may be easiest to ignore yaw altogether and just maneuver by rolling slightly and pitching. if mounted on not struted part) 2. put your main gear slightly behind center of mass. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. This is all right if their high efficiency saves enough fuel, but that may not be the case in small spaceplanes with limited fuel capacity. Your plane is almost finished. Powered by Invision Community. I just thought my planes were too heavy or not enough control surfaces. I scoured the entire web for a solution, but found no working solution or at least dont work every time. Hit the launch button and watch your magnificent bird fly! Espaol - Latinoamrica (Spanish - Latin America), http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484107795, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484107807, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484107735, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484107761, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484119427, http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/52080-Basic-Aircraft-Design-Explained-Simply-With-Pictures, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484137556, http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/443953434412162923/42B3BB54A6A524CCC2E5C102AD88C8E521790F55/. As you would expect, spaceplanes need wings: they have various shapes and dimensions, and they differ basically in lift rating: you will want to have enough lift to keep your fuselage approximately prograde during your ascent to orbit. Let it get good and clear of the ground before applying any control to it. That will align with the craft axis. This tutorial was created primarily based on a Reddit post by the incredibly helpful u/AnArgonianSpellsword. Tips aplenty in this thread: http://kerbalspaceprogram.com/forum/showthread.php/13851-The-woes-of-building-a-space-plane?highlight=woes+spaceplane It taught me everything I know, except for the stuff I learned elsewhere. Whether you're storing your fuel in fuselage sections, wing sections, or attached inside of cargo bays, it's generally a good idea to keep equal amounts of fuel at equal distances from your center of mass. You can post now and register later. here are some images and a gif. At that point, the plane could potentially start spinning around as a result of losing the benefit of the gimbal control of the engine. I see absolutely no need to be traveling that fast down the runway. . My first test of the plane parts in KSP2.Like and Subscribe for more Kerbal stuffs!#kerbalspaceprogram #ksp2 #kerbalspaceprogram2 #shorts #spaceplane #nasa Sometimes taking things off and re-attaching them does it, or you may have to go so far as to scrap the design and rebuild. You can also angle the wings themselves slightly upwards (using WASDQE) in order to make them generate more lift when horizontal. Elevators are usually places in the front or back of an aircraft, and their function, as the name implies, is to change the pitch of the nose up and down. Is there a way to place landing gear so that i can guarantee my plane can remain stable on the runway even at high speed in excess of 200m/s? Even if you can takeoff, landing will usually destroy tat aircraft so survival rate on an aircraft for a typical kerbal is nearly zero. Paste as plain text instead, Notice how the landing gears are placed out on the wings. As such, you will need various control surfaces. What you ought to be using is the Swept Wings and Elevon 1s instead of the Delta-Deluxe Winglets. i have no idea why this happens please help. 4. If, instead, all goes well, then once your jet engines have shut down you will need to start the second part of your space mission by switching to rockets. Espaol - Latinoamrica (Spanish - Latin America), http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/65638-Basic-Airplane-Space-Plane-Aero-Tutorial. How to Fly a Plane - KSP Beginner's Tutorial - YouTube 0:00 / 25:53 How to Fly a Plane - KSP Beginner's Tutorial Mike Aben 30.6K subscribers 78K views 2 years ago KSP - Absolute Beginner's. You could do it the kerbal way by attaching two SRBs to the nose of the plane pointing upwards. Here's a quick installment in to the. Increasing the number of intakes will not allow you to continue using your jet engines at higher altitudes. Aim to get your speed below 50m/s, and have plenty of water ahead of you; keep the plane level, and pitch up to shed velocity. Thanks for the help guys. Nothing bad will happen. These have an ISP of 800 in a vacuum which is significantly better than all other rocket motors except the very weak IX-6315 ion rocket. The plane is clearly unstable. Powered by Invision Community. . Clear editor. Ailerons to roll your aircraft should be placed as far off to the edges of your wings as possible. It is also common to add an Inline Clamp-O-Tron, which, unlike all the other docking ports, can be placed in the middle of the spacecraft (a handy solution, since there is not much space at either end of the craft) to allow your plane to dock with space stations or other spacecrafts. The design I used is similar to what I normally used for planes but I had to swap out parts and make it smaller to compensate for Career mode changes. Keep in mind that lift rating and control surfaces are not connected: lift rating is basically the capacity of your wings to sustain the weight of your spaceplane, while control surfaces are parts of wing that can be moved to change the flow of the air around the plane and through this change a plane's direction, angle of attack or inclination. All trademarks are property of their respective owners in the US and other countries. You can either go with four "LY-O1 Fixed" or a tricycle of two LY-01 near the back and one "LY-05 Steerable" at the front; either is fine for now. Some testing is usually required with new designs to determine the best ascent profile. It is also advisable to add some control surfaces to your plane to have some control in the atmosphere: you can manually add them to the wings or choose winglets with effective control surfaces, like the Standard Canard. When your nose is stable at about 10 degrees above the horizon, pull up hard and keep it pulled. Those and the fixed main gear are NOTORIOUSLY bouncy. While having the same stock parts as in the VAB, spaceplane design is obviously quite different from pure rocket design. So yesterday I was playing some KSP2, and resumed the game from a save where I had landed in Duna. Real planes do this as well. To avoid wobble, wheels need to be absolutely vertical, and they shouldn't be attached to something that is likely to flex as speed builds up, as this could also affect the vertical alignment. Symmetry placement should give you perfect symmetry, as far as the game is concerned. The issue is my plane rolls very sharply to the left any time I pitch up. This is good for spaceplanes operating in low-oxygen atmospheres where jet engines can't be used. This page was last edited on 19 February 2020, at 07:08. To recover the most value from your spaceplane, you should try to land on the runway at the Space Center (this tutorial, although it has been written for spacecraft and not spaceplanes, is a great help). The centre of mass was between the 2 landing gears. 2 will usually do nicely, but 3 or 4 are usually better (but of course heavier, and this tutorial assumes you use 2). 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. http://kerbalspaceprogram.com/forum/showthread.php/13851-The-woes-of-building-a-space-plane?highlight=woes+spaceplane. Landing can be trickier for spaceplanes since they are designed for higher speeds than other aircraft and may not be able to fly level at speeds low enough for an easy landing (<50 m/s). (Yes, you personally, you lucky thing! I shouldn't have placed landing gears on the fuselage, I found that placing landing gears on flat surfaces like wings make landing gears a lot more stable. T-1 "Dart" engines are unique amongst conventionally-fuelled rocket engines: They have close to the highest efficiency in both vacuum and low atmosphere. To minimize the risk of such a situation, try to land on a large patch of flat open ground approaching a downhill slope. This is either a collider or design issue, if the craft doesn't have enough lift initially to get off the ground it will bounce a bit before taking off. Install S5 moon rocket By lightbreaker_64. Keep your nose pointed prograde as you descend through the atmosphere. I took off and at 60 m/s I was in the air! Thank you and happy landings. Here is the best aircraft I have created to date: Jet Aircraft. When flying straight the plane is pretty stable but pitching up causes a sharp roll and I cant figure out why. Check out the following guide for some good info: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/52080-Basic-Aircraft-Design-Explained-Simply-With-Pictures A FedEx cargo plane in Austin nearly landed on a runway where a Southwest flight was preparing to take off. Thanks for all the help. Go on, and take the plane capsule which looks like a converted fuel storage device. In an aircraft with two or more engines, this can potentially cause you to enter a flat spin which can be unrecoverable if your center of mass is behind your center of lift. KSP 2 speculation: I believe terraforming will be a feature of the game. All I have are the parts from the Aerodynamics tech and the gear bay (wheels). Note: The large delta wing will ensure you won't backflip. Just after having taken off, the plane will immediately start rolling to the right, and completely uncontrollably. Cure: Draw a mental axis from the nose to the tail of the plane and use the rotate tool (summetry on), on one of the wheels. As lift increases you remove some strain on the gear, however you've just increased the amount of sag. As such, don't use control surfaces as substitutes for wings, and don't use more control surfaces than you need. You want to start by attaching a Mk 0 Liquid Fuel Tank under the wings, making sure you're mirrored so it goes under both wings. I made this aircraft based on real life commercial jet design. This is also the same reason why planes start rolling toward the middle of the runway; because both ends of the runway are further from . Alternatively, you can try landing at higher speeds with your nose pointed further down, but this increases challenges with stability and deceleration while on the runway. This thread is archived . This can easily cause you to crash on landing. For an example, see the A-10 Warthog's landing gears: link. It provides a wider, more stable wheel base while keeping the wheels straight up and down (no camber). For some reason, when the plane is trying to take off and pulling up, the plane begins to bounce on it's front wheels (the back wheel kicks up), which hinders the plane taking off. You've just unlocked "Aviation" tech, you have a bunch of contracts that require you to stay at low altitude, and you want to build your first plane? Keep your spaceplane pointed about 90 degrees above prograde so that the wings and body of your aircraft slow you down as much as possible. You cannot paste images directly. A relatively low-drag alternative is to use an inverted cargo bay and some hydraulic cylinders with structural panels as a cargo elevator. These occur at their worst when your center of gravity is far ahead of your rear landing gears and you have a heavy plane at high speeds and a high angle of attack on landing, resulting in your front landing gear rapidly striking the runway after your rear landing gears touchdown. I believe the issue is there is not enough control surfaces to offset this issue, but it comes up very easy so it is not a very big deal. Maybe ;making the tailwheel less stiff would help, too. Plane spins/lurches to the side during takeoff? Either one of those being misaligned will cause instability on the runway during takeoff (and the engines misaligned will cause flight problems). An alternative is making sure you have complete control of the craft. This is just a general briefing section with lots of "to do" or "not to do" things: when you think you've got it, check the Aeris 4A tutorial mission to learn how to get into space easily. The rudder is mostly used when landing and when attempting to line up a shot (in a fighter plane). Also pay attention to your fuel balance, especially if you're using several tanks placed in parallel to each other. My Space Plane Keeps Flipping Backwards On The Runway. That said, parachutes are an exceedingly effective means of reducing your stopping distance. 200 m/s runway stability just doesn't seem to have a worthwhile purpose to me, and is inducing counter productive engineering challenges. Hello, I am having a small problem with a plane I have built. Your link has been automatically embedded. I dont really need 200m/s for take off. If you placed the main wings at the centre of mass and then added the smaller wings behind, this should be correct already. When your jet engines stop working, it is time to ignite the old, reliable liquid fuel engine. If you use an Advanced SAS, and raise your front landing wheel so that it is higher than the rear wheels, by just turning the SAS on and going full throttle, due to the 10 degree angle of the plane, it should eventually take off by itself. This is generally an issue of not spacing your landing gears out far enough apart. They could go up to 120 m/s on the runway and still not lift up. When gear is placed, it has just one point of attachment. Mods needed for this aircraft to work: Procedural wings, Adjustable Landing Gear, FAR. I was attaining high speeds on the runway without getting off the ground, which made the plane yaw back and forth. 2. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. You want an elevon on each set of wings. However, don't bother going overboard with intakes because your engines will still shut off at high altitudes due to the low air pressure regardless of how many intakes you have. I have built lots of spaceplanes. This makes design easier, eliminating all concern for balancing jet fuel against rocket fuel. Vice versa a plane with lots of control surfaces will be perfectly controllable (maybe even too much) but may have big difficulties with taking off and landing at reasonable speeds. Your previous content has been restored. You can even try refueling it before recovering your spaceplane further increasing your recovering value. Edit: I made a simple easy plane in career mode that is both stable and cheap: A trick i've used before is to put modular girders on the sides of the fuselage and putting the gear on the bottom of the girders. Try not to place your gears to wings, especially wingtips - if they wobble even slightly, your plane lose the balance. mods used are OPT for most of the body and the front canards and tail plane, B9 procedural wings for the wings, and mk4 spaceplane parts for the engines. This makes them a very effective choice for SSTOs since they do a good job of getting maximum velocity out of air-breathing mode, and then allow you to use oxidizer without needing the added weight and drag of a separate rocket engine. KSP handling death investigation High Winds Cause Widespread Power Outages Ohio . Suggest a Correction Copyright 2023 Nexstar Media Inc. All rights reserved. I dunno why but this picture makes the one side look like it is tipped in but I know they are straight, I believe it just the angle that the picture was taken that is causing it to look like this. Controllability of a plane is on you. Be aware that while this angle will provide the lowest possible landing speed for your spaceplane, it will create problems if your center of gravity is too far ahead of your rear landing gears (causing a high-speed nose collision on touchdown) or if your rear landing gears are too far ahead of your engines, causing them to strike the runway first. One final point to consider is the mass you're planning to store in the fuselage. Pasted as rich text. Do you have a screenshot of the craft? Try getting the wings to deflect the air down, either by lifting the front end up using canards or by mounting them at an angle using shift + wasdqe. https://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?title=Tutorial:_Your_First_Plane&oldid=103052. To takeoff and land at low speed, it's helpful to rotate the wings so the leading edge is slightly above the trailing edge. Close to empty tanks will allow you to fly slower, decelerate faster, and reduce touchdown strain. If there is, I would have found it long ago. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. I worked through the tutorials and I think my problem was most often a lack of lift, or perhaps more accurately sufficient control surfaces. Consequently, atmospheric reentry is less dangerous with a Mk2 or Mk3 fuselage, compared to reentry with Mk1 fuselages. My plane usually take off at a little over 120m/s. Note: This is ONLY to be used to report spam, advertising, and problematic (harassment, fighting, or rude) posts. Need to move them up. Second try, speed over land reached over 210 m/s and it didn't flip. Beyond that, you're going to get some wobble once you get close to take off speed. Set up for a long glide path, and watch rate of climb indicator at top of screen, aim for -5 m/s. When you are near the end of the runway, quickly activate then detach them to get the nose pointing up. However, they do take a conventional mix of fuel and oxidizer, and thus require much more fuel mass than jet engines or LV-N Nerv. Wow, if you need 200 m\s to take off, you should think about adding more lift. It is advised to place your control surfaces as far from your center of mass as possible. An aircraft without control surfaces is like a rocket without RCS or reaction wheels - it will hardly turn and will be equally hard to control (perhaps even impossible!). http://www.youtube.com/user/Cruzanak?. - SF. But also check to make sure that your wheels are placed symmetrically and your engines are aligned properly. Go on, and take the plane capsule which looks like a converted fuel storage device Contents 1 Making a fuselage 2 Understanding Lift 3 Control Surfaces 3.1 Elevator 3.2 Aileron 3.3 Rudder 4 Landing gear Making a fuselage Any plane needs speed - so you need thrust (usually). Powered by Invision Community. This thread is quite old. After a successful touchdown, high-speed motion on the runway (let alone uneven ground) can be unstable, causing the aircraft to careen to one side or the other, potentially resulting in loss of a wing and sometimes the entire aircraft. Be warned that if you do not provide sufficient air intakes for the engines you've placed, you may find that some of your engines shut down before others. I can not get any aircraft-style spaceplane take off from the runway, they will stay on until the end, where the engines crash into the ground and explode. I am definitely aware that there are multiple reasons as to why the plane flips. A Mk1 Cockpit, two Mk 1 Liquid Fuel Tanks, and then cap the back with a round nose cone (use the A/D keys to rotate it as necessary). * Unlock steering and disable brakes on front gear. See if there is still a problem when only travelling slowly, say <20m/s. Because of how small Kerbin is and how high its gravity is, a perfectly flat surface just north of the equator will cause planes taking off to bias to the right of the runway, as if they were rolling downhill. Try disabling friction control with on the front landing gears. You cannot paste images directly. There are multiple ways to place them: Ailerons control the roll of the aircraft, and are (almost) always placed on the wings, as far out as possible and as centered (compared to the center of mass) as could be. (Idea is moot, if you haven't unlocked them yet.) EDIT: So, I set the front landing gear spring and damper to 0.5, and also set the tail gear spring and damper to 2, and the problem was fixed! 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